IsoLine
User
Posts: 1,025 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 1:07 AM
FlynnsWrist Wrote:Icon57 Wrote:| FlynnsWrist Wrote:the tim burton camp and cris nolan camp aesthetic thingy in the internet world. its just like high school. the dumb jocks, the weird goth guy, the art farts and the nerds. take your pick bozo. |
God I hate myself for getting into this, but I guess a bit of self-flagellation can be healthy...
You're really saying that Burton did a better job with Batman than Nolan did? I have no great love for Batman Begins and I think that people have always been a little hysterical over Dark Knight, but it's nearly impossible to argue that Burton made better movies. They were camp, their pacing was broken, the characterization was way off the mark, and they were more exercises in Burton's signature, overplayed aesthetic than movies in their own right. The dialogue was contrived and awkward, the casting of Batman himself was poor, production design was a mixed bag...
I guess what I'm saying is that at some point it stops being about which "camp" you're in and starts being about stepping back and evaluating whether a movie is one you enjoy or whether it's actually a really good movie. There is a difference. |
there you go...you couldnt help yourself. Almost everything you hated. Do you know all that you said I feel the same way about Nolan and his ilk. the cherry on the cake was his direction on bales "low raspy contrived" voice of batman. lol. TO me it made such a mockery of batman because we knew bale natural voice was far from that.
To you its camp. to us burton's a recognized artist in the film industry. If it wasnt he wouldnt be making blockbuster films till today and with johnny depp, the coolest guy with a dress sense girls actually screamed few good minutes in the pirate of the carribean awards. you are way over your head on this. Nolan aesthetics is not recognised. He is lauded for his pacing and camera work which is actually the director of photography and not him. So you point is more personal than the industry recognition.
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Well, all I am going to say about the whole Burton Nolan Batman wars thing is that back in the day a new Batman movie was a big deal. Burton was not as big a director back then as he is today, but he had the vision to go from campy crusader to dark knight. We also didn't have what Nolan had which was a lot of computer aided techniques and super pretty young stars that wanted to be a costumed superhero. Remember back then the tendancy to do a movie like that was more likely to kill your career than help it. Actors didn't want to be covered up in masks and not fully promoted in the role looking like themselves and they sure as hell didn't want to do a superhero movie that could spell the end of their careers if only kids liked it.
"Word to the Motherboard!" - IsoLine
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ShadowDragon1
User
Posts: 2,056 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 1:18 AM
these posts are getting way off-topic. No offence
Now I love the first Tim Burton Batman, and I have listened to soundtrack about 5000 times since 1989.
I did enjoy Batman Begins as is and Dark Knight was good too IMO. I see little wrong with either.
Tim Burton's Batman inspired the most awesome Batman The Animated series and it kept it's classic noir element harkening back to the early The Batman comic strips by Bob Kane. Nolan's IMO did a great job adapting a more modern version of Batman loosely inspired by recent comics and graphic novels. I don't think one is better than the other. I do wish people wouldn't be so harsh on either. They both brought good things to the table. At the time Tim Burton's Batman style of "camp" was a lot more "serious" that awful early 70's Batman show with Adam West.
Tim Burton's Batman It was way more in line with the classic comic strips by Bob Kane and did exeptionally well.
If you want to see "camp" done BAD and I mean terrible, watch Joel Schmuck-mocker's "Batman and Robin"! Talk about AWFUL!
But NOTHING from later Batman movies can equel the awesome soundtrack that Danny Elfman created for the first Burton Batman. That man is an under-rated
mad genius of music composition IMO (listen to any Oingo Boingo album, if one can't see that, one has no taste in good music.)
I thoroughly enjoy Burton's Edward Scissorhands/Nightmare before christmas et all twisted and perky gothic aesthetic style and vibe, and it breaks my heart when some people bash on it.
FFS NO other movies even attempt to express gothic Edward Gorey-ish inspired art in film like Tim Burton has done.
Sure I didn't care much for Willy wonka. I did enjoy Alice in Wonderland, but i do hope for his Dark Shadows film and Frankenweinee he brings back some of that Sleepy Hollow and Nightmare Before Christmas dark but twistedly perky gothic aesthetics and themes. on line abortion pill misoprostol dose abortion medical abortion pill online
"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski
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FlynnsWrist
User
Posts: 64 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 1:54 AM
IsoLine Wrote:FlynnsWrist Wrote:Icon57 Wrote:| FlynnsWrist Wrote:the tim burton camp and cris nolan camp aesthetic thingy in the internet world. its just like high school. the dumb jocks, the weird goth guy, the art farts and the nerds. take your pick bozo. |
God I hate myself for getting into this, but I guess a bit of self-flagellation can be healthy...
You're really saying that Burton did a better job with Batman than Nolan did? I have no great love for Batman Begins and I think that people have always been a little hysterical over Dark Knight, but it's nearly impossible to argue that Burton made better movies. They were camp, their pacing was broken, the characterization was way off the mark, and they were more exercises in Burton's signature, overplayed aesthetic than movies in their own right. The dialogue was contrived and awkward, the casting of Batman himself was poor, production design was a mixed bag...
I guess what I'm saying is that at some point it stops being about which "camp" you're in and starts being about stepping back and evaluating whether a movie is one you enjoy or whether it's actually a really good movie. There is a difference. |
there you go...you couldnt help yourself. Almost everything you hated. Do you know all that you said I feel the same way about Nolan and his ilk. the cherry on the cake was his direction on bales "low raspy contrived" voice of batman. lol. TO me it made such a mockery of batman because we knew bale natural voice was far from that.
To you its camp. to us burton's a recognized artist in the film industry. If it wasnt he wouldnt be making blockbuster films till today and with johnny depp, the coolest guy with a dress sense girls actually screamed few good minutes in the pirate of the carribean awards. you are way over your head on this. Nolan aesthetics is not recognised. He is lauded for his pacing and camera work which is actually the director of photography and not him. So you point is more personal than the industry recognition.
|
Well, all I am going to say about the whole Burton Nolan Batman wars thing is that back in the day a new Batman movie was a big deal. Burton was not as big a director back then as he is today, but he had the vision to go from campy crusader to dark knight. We also didn't have what Nolan had which was a lot of computer aided techniques and super pretty young stars that wanted to be a costumed superhero. Remember back then the tendancy to do a movie like that was more likely to kill your career than help it. Actors didn't want to be covered up in masks and not fully promoted in the role looking like themselves and they sure as hell didn't want to do a superhero movie that could spell the end of their careers if only kids liked it. |
lol. thast kind of true. I think jack invovlement on joker really up the stakes for all involved and made superhero roles a possible achievement to A list actors. He balanced the film with his pyschotic realism edge to the dandy fantastic feel.
I understood nolans very knuckle down gritty no holds bar look, its not ugly but it isnt wat I feel batman should be. And I think the brown sepia tone to the whole gotham is wrong as its not neutral enough to let different characters exude their part. As a comic fan, joker's madness was more of delirium (more colourful and creative as can be seen in his gadgets and coloured suits). Nolan made it plain wicked and dark. If anything, nolan had too much liberty in batman's character.
I can assure you Bob Kane god bless his soul, would not have approved nolans work. Bob kane would never approve the overall brown sepia look.
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FlynnsWrist
User
Posts: 64 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 1:57 AM
ShadowDragon1 Wrote:these posts are getting way off-topic. No offence
Now I love the first Tim Burton Batman, and I have listened to soundtrack about 5000 times since 1989.
I did enjoy Batman Begins as is and Dark Knight was good too IMO. I see little wrong with either.
Tim Burton's Batman inspired the most awesome Batman The Animated series and it kept it's classic noir element harkening back to the early The Batman comic strips by Bob Kane. Nolan's IMO did a great job adapting a more modern version of Batman loosely inspired by recent comics and graphic novels. I don't think one is better than the other. I do wish people wouldn't be so harsh on either. They both brought good things to the table. At the time Tim Burton's Batman style of "camp" was a lot more "serious" that awful early 70's Batman show with Adam West.
Tim Burton's Batman It was way more in line with the classic comic strips by Bob Kane and did exeptionally well.
If you want to see "camp" done BAD and I mean terrible, watch Joel Schmuck-mocker's "Batman and Robin"! Talk about AWFUL!
But NOTHING from later Batman movies can equel the awesome soundtrack that Danny Elfman created for the first Burton Batman. That man is an under-rated
mad genius of music composition IMO (listen to any Oingo Boingo album, if one can't see that, one has no taste in good music.)
I thoroughly enjoy Burton's Edward Scissorhands/Nightmare before christmas et all twisted and perky gothic aesthetic style and vibe, and it breaks my heart when some people bash on it.
FFS NO other movies even attempt to express gothic Edward Gorey-ish inspired art in film like Tim Burton has done.
Sure I didn't care much for Willy wonka. I did enjoy Alice in Wonderland, but i do hope for his Dark Shadows film and Frankenweinee he brings back some of that Sleepy Hollow and Nightmare Before Christmas dark but twistedly perky gothic aesthetics and themes. |
I agree! everything you said! Especially the gay nipple batsuit camp shit part. Now thats camp. danny elfman score....now thats unbeatable....I get goose pimple everytime I hear that part....you know that da da darrr da da.
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CorrupTron
User
Posts: 609 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 2:17 AM
| ShadowDragon1 Wrote:Inception was alright, but IMO way over-rated. |
You're over-rated. 
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ShadowDragon1
User
Posts: 2,056 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 2:27 AM
If i was "over-rated" i'd have a job making $25 an hr.
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"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski
|
typicaltronname
User
Posts: 1,667 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 2:31 AM
CorrupTron Wrote:| ShadowDragon1 Wrote:Inception was alright, but IMO way over-rated. |
You're over-rated. |
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"Reveal your creation date or I will disassemble your code one operation at a time!"
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ShadowDragon1
User
Posts: 2,056 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 3:25 AM
Some jokes just aren't that funny. Watch SNL, it's good evidence of such. >_>abortion pills online abortion pill online purchase cytotec abortion
"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski
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ShadowDragon1
User
Posts: 2,056 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 3:36 AM
I'm refering to SNL circa late 90's and the past 10 yrs. Everytime I randomly watch it, it seems to have gotten more and more not-funny. But the 80's skits were good.
"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski
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Icon57
User
Posts: 150 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 6:29 AM
This conversation should move to another thread, and frankly I don't care that much, but I will point a couple of things out to you.
One:
FlynnsWrist Wrote:there you go...you couldnt help yourself. Almost everything you hated. Do you know all that you said I feel the same way about Nolan and his ilk.
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Rhetoric. I actually didn't hate Burton's Batman movies. Quite to the contrary; I think they're fun. But a fun movie is not the same as a good movie.
Maybe I went about it backwards. Instead of pointing out why Burton is worse, I should have gone about why Nolan was better, especially since I seem to have touched a nerve. *shrug* gets to the same place in the end.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:the cherry on the cake was his direction on bales "low raspy contrived" voice of batman. lol. TO me it made such a mockery of batman because we knew bale natural voice was far from that.
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Bale's natural voice is British. Yeah, it was overplayed. So was every character in Burton's flicks.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:To you its camp. to us burton's a recognized artist in the film industry. If it wasnt he wouldnt be making blockbuster films till today
|
Dude, how many hacks are still working in Hollywood? No points.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:and with johnny depp, the coolest guy with a dress sense girls actually screamed few good minutes in the pirate of the carribean awards.
|
Yeah. Every single movie. Burton has churned out the same quirky goth-lite movie starring Depp every time he's sat in the director's chair. Who you work with is not a measure of making quality flicks in Hollywood. Bay directed Damon in Pearl Harbour, remember.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:you are way over your head on this.
|
No, I'm not. I'm presenting an argument based on having seen all the flicks a few times as well as other stuff the directors have done and you're reacting poorly. Be a good sport, man. I didn't go after you personally, unless you are Tim Burton, in which case we need to have a serious conversation about what happened with Willy Wonka.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:Nolan aesthetics is not recognised. He is lauded for his pacing and camera work which is actually the director of photography and not him.
|
I would venture that Nolan doesn't directly replicate his visual style in every movie he makes whereas Burton does. Maybe that's why there isn't a Nolan aesthetic. Time will tell.
Now, as for pacing being solely the work of the DP? Not the case. Cinematography affects pacing, it's true, but the director keeps the actors in the scene moving and on pace, supervises the DP to ensure that the camera moves and composition keep pace, and oversees the edit to ensure that the editor maintains the pace.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:So you point is more personal than the industry recognition.
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a) If this thread proves anything, it's that industry recognition is a bogus measure of quality and b) yeah, it's personal, but it's based in reality, not just my opinion.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:I can assure you Bob Kane god bless his soul, would not have approved nolans work.
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You have a secret seance to chat with Bob, or something? Do you remember Batman at the beginning? Gritty as hell. Fewer outlandish gadgets. More guns, thugs, mobs, and terrorism. I think Bob Kane would have dug Nolan's taste, personally, but what the creator would think is ultimately kind of irrelevant. If the movie is good, if the fundamentals are there, adaptations need to stretch and grow on their own.
FlynnsWrist Wrote:Especially the gay nipple batsuit camp shit part.
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Not necessary. Schumacker made terrible movies but let's not gaybash while we make that point, yeah? Even terrible, terrible costume design does not give license for homophobia.
Anyways, I guess what I'm getting at (and to bring it back to the point of the thread) is that at some point one has to recognize the shortcomings in a movie, even if you like it. Tron didn't deserve to be in a lot of categories at the Oscars even though I loved the hell out of it. Daft Punk was up against a lot of talent this year and probably shouldn't have made the cut. Digital Domain got punked on visual effects, and the costumers... I'm split on that one. But just because I enjoyed Tron: Legacy doesn't mean that I'm going to argue that it's a fantastic movie; it's deeply, I'd say almost fundamentally flawed (while also being entertaining and hella awesome).
KEEP THE LEGACY ALIVE -- TR3N LIVES
http://tr3nlives.com
View the thread: http://www.tron-sector.com/forums/default.aspx?a=top&id=401026
Development blog and more: http://spillwaybrain.wordpress.com
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Stygian
User
![]()
Posts: 26 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 11:08 AM
| FlynnsWrist Wrote:Do you know all that you said I feel the same way about Nolan and his ilk. the cherry on the cake was his direction on bales "low raspy contrived" voice of batman. lol. TO me it made such a mockery of batman because we knew bale natural voice was far from that. |
Bale's voice?? Are you serious? You would dislike a movie because the actor pitched his voice lower, especially when this made story sense? It is truly a first world problem when we can't pick out better things to dislike about a movie than the pitch of an actor's voice. And to compare a "raspy voice" Bale to Burton's overall direction (or misdirection as appears to be the assertion by some) and say that Nolan is worse due to this reasoning is somewhat overreaching.
I like bits and pieces of both directorial interpretations. For instance; I think Burton did a wonderful job with the production design and even though Keaton was perhaps and underwhelming Bruce Wayne his take on Batman was twisted and dark, which is exactly what it needed to be. Nolan is able to infuse a real-world sensibility to his take which is exactly what the character needs to have a place in the modern world. In fact if I may be so bold, if you took both approaches and melded them together in just the right way I think you'd have just about the perfect Batman movie.
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Kat
User
Posts: 2,394 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Monday, February, 28, 2011 8:32 PM
| Stygian Wrote: It is truly a first world problem when we can't pick out better things to dislike about a movie than the pitch of an actor's voice. . |
I would say it's a "first world problem" that we watch movies at all, wouldn't you?
What do you want? I'm busy.
Program, please!
Chaos.... good news.
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ShadowSpark
User
Posts: 2,943 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Tuesday, March, 01, 2011 1:33 PM
Since no theaters in my area were playing Tron Legacy that day, here's what I did: I dressed up in my costume, watched Tron four times, listened to the soundtracks for both movies, worked a bit on my Tron fanfics, went outside to play with my throw-able disk, came back in, watched Tron again, played the story mode of Tron Evolution all the way through, then went to bed. That was my day.on line abortion pill misoprostol dose abortion medical abortion pill onlineorder abortion pill abortion pill buy online where to buy abortion pillwhere to buy abortion pill ordering abortion pills to be shipped to house buy abortion pill online
{A very big thanks to FlynnOne for the pic! And to Wulfeous for sharpening the details!*huggles both*}
{Because people always seem to guess wrong, I'm saying it here: I'm female!!! And my name is Spark!!!}
Tron Lives!
Please click here to help my family out.
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TRON.dll
User
Posts: 4,349 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Tuesday, March, 01, 2011 1:45 PM
Gibson Wrote:| ShadowDragon1 Wrote:I'm refering to SNL circa late 90's and the past 10 yrs. Everytime I randomly watch it, it seems to have gotten more and more not-funny. But the 80's skits were good. |
I agree, SNL sucked after the early 90's |
dude snl is the funniest show ever heres a joke from snl
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TRON 2.0 (PC) name - TRON.dll
I'll play any mode, but I'm best at LC.
PSN - TRON-dll
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Disc Warrior
User
Posts: 659 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Tuesday, March, 01, 2011 2:17 PM
| ShadowSpark Wrote:Since no theaters in my area were playing Tron Legacy that day, here's what I did: I dressed up in my costume, watched Tron four times, listened to the soundtracks for both movies, worked a bit on my Tron fanfics, went outside to play with my throw-able disk, came back in, watched Tron again, played the story mode of Tron Evolution all the way through, then went to bed. That was my day. |
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ShadowSpark
User
Posts: 2,943 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Tuesday, March, 01, 2011 3:22 PM
Disc Warrior Wrote:| ShadowSpark Wrote:Since no theaters in my area were playing Tron Legacy that day, here's what I did: I dressed up in my costume, watched Tron four times, listened to the soundtracks for both movies, worked a bit on my Tron fanfics, went outside to play with my throw-able disk, came back in, watched Tron again, played the story mode of Tron Evolution all the way through, then went to bed. That was my day. |
That's awesome... |
Total Tron spazz-out.... *sighs in contentment*
So what did the rest of you guys who had no cooperating theaters do on the 27th?
{A very big thanks to FlynnOne for the pic! And to Wulfeous for sharpening the details!*huggles both*}
{Because people always seem to guess wrong, I'm saying it here: I'm female!!! And my name is Spark!!!}
Tron Lives!
Please click here to help my family out.
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Boba Fettuccini
User
Posts: 779 | RE: "Derezz! the Oscars" Day - Event
on Tuesday, March, 01, 2011 4:12 PM
ShadowSpark Wrote:Total Tron spazz-out.... *sighs in contentment*
So what did the rest of you guys who had no cooperating theaters do on the 27th? |
I sat in a Starbucks for 6 hours doing homework, and working on a music project.
-==[ www.boba-fettuccini.com ]==-
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