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HooDooMan
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Posts: 585
Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Wednesday, October, 06, 2010 12:00 AM
I've been noticing a discrepancy in several articles about TRON: Legacy concerning the time dilation effect while Kevin Flynn is inside the TRON world. Most of the recent articles I've been reading are stating that one year in the real world is like 1000 years in the TRON world, so therefore, since Kevin Flynn has been in the server for 20 years real world time, that equates to 20,000 years in the TRON world.

I distinctly remember an article or interview with Joe Kosinski stating that time scales about 50 times faster in the TRON world than it does in the real world. So 20 years in the real world equates to 1000 years in the TRON world.

I think there was a "page" from one of Kevin Flynn's books, as part of the ARG, that had a statement that 1 year is like 1000 years in the TRON world, or something like that, which is probably where the 20,000 years is coming from.

My question is, which one is right? Either way, it's a heck of a long time! order abortion pill abortion pill buy online where to buy abortion pill


 
Mr. Sinistar
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Posts: 1,642
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Wednesday, October, 06, 2010 12:15 AM
HooDooMan Wrote:I've been noticing a discrepancy in several articles about TRON: Legacy concerning the time dilation effect while Kevin Flynn is inside the TRON world. Most of the recent articles I've been reading are stating that one year in the real world is like 1000 years in the TRON world, so therefore, since Kevin Flynn has been in the server for 20 years real world time, that equates to 20,000 years in the TRON world.

I distinctly remember an article or interview with Joe Kosinski stating that time scales about 50 times faster in the TRON world than it does in the real world. So 20 years in the real world equates to 1000 years in the TRON world.

I think there was a "page" from one of Kevin Flynn's books, as part of the ARG, that had a statement that 1 year is like 1000 years in the TRON world, or something like that, which is probably where the 20,000 years is coming from.

My question is, which one is right? Either way, it's a heck of a long time!

As a admin for Tron Wiki, I can definitely tell you that there are A LOT of discrepancies in Tron info that's out there. Both for the first and second movies.

My impression was that Flynn was stuck for 2000 years. Hopefully the movie will answer this directly.


OPEN SOURCE TRON PROJECT


"what the hell is a limux.."

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Imbroglio
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Posts: 416
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Wednesday, October, 06, 2010 1:29 AM
Wouldn't this be the other way around if you apply the theory as to what happens when one travels near the speed of light? For every 1 year Flynn experiences in the computer, 1300 years would have passed in the real world.



 
aldul
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Posts: 194
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Wednesday, October, 06, 2010 3:54 PM
The Tron universe is not a part of our space-time, so dilation is not an issue. I think the argument is that there's no matter in Tron, so everything being energy and clocked at a high rate by the system clock, moves and 'ticks' at a much higher rate than we do out here.

Since this is all make-believe anyway, we can argue that the digitizing laser produces a tunneling effect allowing information to travel between the two continuums. Sure, why not.abortion pills online abortion pill online purchase cytotec abortion


 



Posts: 0
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy
on Wednesday, October, 06, 2010 9:02 PM



"While 28 years have passed in the real world, over 1000 years have passed in the TRON one."

Source:
Tron: The Official Site (Codex) - http://disney.go.com/tron/html/codex/tron-universe.html



- - - - -




"For every Gregorian Year that passes in the real world, 50 TC (Tron Cycles) have passed on the Grid."

Source:
Tron - The Official Site (Lightcycle Game): http://disney.go.com/tron/index_flash.html






- - - - -




"...(W)hen we quantify electrical impulses, those speeds are over 1,000 greater - so, if life could exist in a purely digital form, that organism would experience 1,000 years for every one year of our time on earth. When I work on my special project, it's as if time stands still in the "real world." Sam's grandparents can sit with him while I toil for what seems like a week, but when I return, they barely notice I've gone."

Source:
time.theory.compare.notes at http://www.helloflynn.com/










 
Traahn
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Posts: 3,273
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Wednesday, October, 06, 2010 9:33 PM
Time dilation. I posted the above, but forum's glitches didn't bump the thread or put my name next to it.


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. -----^
 
cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 8:51 AM
Tron Unit Wrote:Just how does Flynn age if he's been trapped there for 20 years? Physically he shouldn't because he's just a digital construct of himself in the Real World. Theoretically he should look identical to Clu just as he did in the old system. The laws of physical spacetime should not apply. If he returns to the Real World in 2010 he should look as he did in 1989 and start to age again normally once he's back in the physical world.

I've wondered about that, and I've been thinking it might be because he's a User rather than a program. I don't know what's different that would cause that, but at least it's an idea order abortion pill http://unclejohnsprojects.com/template/default.aspx?morning-after-pill-price where to buy abortion pill


 
ShadowDragon1
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Posts: 2,056
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 9:25 AM
Flynn ages normally due to genetic algorythms he wrote to preserve his DNA/RNA pattern. So he ages the normal 20 some years even as construct of code, and because he' a User. Programs don't age because their code is different from a Users, so they don't appear to physically age. The Grid wasn't fully "finished" most likely...

Flynn could conceivably, l (from outside The Grid, in the Real World) patch the code later so that Programs have an artificial life span where they appear to "age" and eventually fade derezz after a certain number of cycles have passed and then the system replaces them with a new Program to continue to fill the function of the old Program.

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 10:28 AM
Shadowdragon, is that genetic algorithm thing from something? One of Flynn's notes or the official website? I don't remember reading about it before.

Also, I guess maybe he could edit the programs so that they age...but what's in it for the program I imagine they'd be pretty keen on not getting old.


 
cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 12:49 PM
Well even if a User still ages in the digital world, it's much much slower than in the real one. We know Flynn's been in there for at least 1000 years, so that's probably close enough to immortality for most people
(Incidently, I hope the final answer to how long he's been in there is closer to 1000 rather than the 20000 years idea I've seen floating around. I can kinda wrap my mind around 1000 years, but 20000 just seems so long that it becomes unbelievable that Flynn would be at all recognizable as the same person. Heck I doubt he would really seem Human after that long)where to buy abortion pill http://blog.bitimpulse.com/template/default.aspx?abortion-types buy abortion pill online


 
ShadowDragon1
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Posts: 2,056
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 12:50 PM
Flynn's computer system is *not* the same system for TRON (1982) , i.e. it not the Encom 511. So Flynn wrote in slightly different "rules" and such into his system. He uploaded Programs (Basics) to populate The Grid at first, then later a new form of digital beings materialize... i.e. The system /the Grid "evolved" beyond it's original peramiters. So it's side effects of that became unpredictable.... The Grid was not entirely finished or "perfected" on an intrisic level when he got trapped there.

Alan Bradley mentions that Flynn was talking to him about "Genetic Algorythms" and "quantum teleportation".

The following is speculation based on what various elements of Tron Legacy backstory from Tron Betrayal and material from Flynn Lives related content/info (nothing specific from Joe Kosinski)

Genetic Algorythms probably preserve Flynn's DNA/RNA pattern, but either a flaw in the system or Flynn *percieving* himself to have aged over the course of many cycles & real world years resulted in him appearing to have aged.

A User's mind I think *does* seem to have some subtle influence on how he percieves the digital universe (in the old system and now in The Grid) and his interactions with it ( related to "User Power", such as when Flynn used his mind to re-build a Recognizer from broke apart pieces of a Recognizer)..

So if Flynn, who's been trapped in the system for 20,000 virtual years (seeming like an eternity), he probably feels and perceives himself to age 20-30 yrs.
If he returns to the real world, will he be 35 again? Maybe, or maybe not. Depends if the DNA/RNA routines that preserved and put his pattern in stasis, or if the routines where progressive, allowing for slow, gradual biological aging based on a normal 24 hr period and progression of real-world time.

I think this is what's going on, and makes sense to me. where to buy abortion pill abortion types buy abortion pill online

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
ShadowDragon1
User

Posts: 2,056
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 1:53 PM
I really think your overthinking what is essentially a quasi-mystical cyber-punk fairytale in the vein of Rip Van Wrinkle, Narnia, and the Wizard of Oz.
A mythological tale framed in cyber-tech framework but not wholely meant to be 100% plausible. Intended as an imaginative cyber-tech-ish fairytale.

In such a case, a bit of suspension of disbelief is needed in my opinion.
This movie ad the orginal was *not* pure hard science fiction. No one, neither the film, the director, etc is asking you to "buy into" anything.

And could you break up your paragraphs please? The wall of text is hard on the eyes and makes me want to not read your post.

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
Traahn
User

Posts: 3,273
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 2:32 PM
I wonder how many years Dumont was the Tower Guardian in the Tron world? Is he stuck on Encom 511, or has he been duplicated to other systems via the Internet? If he was duplicated, do all of his versions across all servers have the same age and age progression rate as the original Dumont?

Actually, I'm not curious about this.

I just want to know the generalities of time progression in the computer compared to real world, and the movie (or just thinking about it more) will help me understand this. I don't need to reason away via "it's on a different server" or anything.

I don't need perfect scientifically tested answers for this, as there's a little bit of "just accept" when it comes to the Tron world. I don't need or want perfect answers for everything and hope Kosinski and future Tron movies don't set out to try and explain everything for us.


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. -----^
 
ShadowDragon1
User

Posts: 2,056
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Friday, December, 03, 2010 7:56 PM
Sorry if something I said came off as condesending. But please, it's hard to read your post when it has no paragraph breaks.

I also don't see the point in focusing in on one, in my opinion, insignificant thing. Also It's kinda of rude to me to shoot down and dismiss and knock down my speculations of how *I* am interpruting things.

Now the fact is, that there is no specific explaination for why Flynn aged 20-30 yrs while in The Grid, he just did, and IMO that doesn't really need an explanation.
The Grid, is in-a-sense an alternate reality, another world, like "Oz", "Narnia", Elysium, or some Nether world.

It's like expecting a scientific explaination of why water melted the Wicked Witch in The Wizard of Oz. IMO it's just not that important, so I don't see the point of singling that one thing out.

No offense, but it seems your over thinking this one minor thing. I'm not being condensending here oand I'm not saying or implying you can't voice your view or opinion.
This movie is a cyber-space twist on a type of Wizard of Oz fairytale. Super real-life scientific or psuedo-scientific explanations are not needed for that kind of story or fictional universe IMO.
Tron isn't a documentary on science and technology of computer tech. So I don't get this need to frame it in such a context.

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
insidetronworld
User

Posts: 35
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Thursday, December, 23, 2010 12:51 PM
Ok, so did anyone notice when Finn was talking to Sam about how long the portial stays open? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought he said it only stays open for about "ONE MICO SECOND, OR ABOUT EIGHT HOURS." Did I hear that right?

So I did a little math and and if one mico second in our time = 8 hours in their world wouldn't that be an OOPS? Because they clearly said a1000 cycles in the new movie.

So the next queston would be how long is a cycle? Because if you do the math it don't add up. For exsample 1 second in our time would = 8000 hours or 333.3333 Days in the tron world.

1 minute would = over 54 years in their time.
1 hour would = 3,285 years
1 day would = 78,850 years
1 year in our time would be 28,800,000 years in their time.
20 years would be 576 million years in the digil world.

That sounds like hell to me. To be trapped in there for that long. That would make a 1,000 years sound like a day in the park wouldn't you think.

Of course its only a movie, but if you really was trapped in their like that wouldn't you want to get out too? So for keven to sacrafice himself for his son opens up a whole new level in the Tron story. Will there be a tron three? It looks like they left it open for that.


 
DigiCom
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Posts: 9
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Thursday, December, 23, 2010 1:35 PM
He said "1 millicycle" not microsecond.


 
HooDooMan
User

Posts: 585
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Thursday, December, 23, 2010 2:34 PM
DigiCom Wrote:He said "1 millicycle" not microsecond.

What DigiCom said.

And if you figure that a "cycle" is roughly the same as a year, when you do the math, it just about works out:

365 days x 24 hours = 8760 hours in a year or 1 "cycle"

1 millicycle = one thousandth of a cycle or 1/1000

8760 hours / 1000 = 8.76 hours

so, 1 "millicycle" = 8.76 hours

(I was never that great at math, so somebody check my work! LOL!)

By the way, I'm not sure where I got the equivalent of 1 cycle = 1 year from. It seems I read it somewhere, but I can't remember where at the moment. (It's hell getting old! LOL!)



 
ShadowDragon1
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Posts: 2,056
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Thursday, December, 23, 2010 3:15 PM
1 milicycle = 8 hrs

3 milicycles = 24 hrs

21 milicycles = 7 days

84 milicycles = 1 week

336 milicycles = 1 month

4032 milicycles = 1 year

80,620 milicycles = 20 yrs.

this is going my simple multiplication and extrapolating from that.

I'm uncertain how many milicycles equels 1000 cycles though. I'm very *not* mathematically inclined... :/


"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
insidetronworld
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Posts: 35
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Thursday, December, 23, 2010 3:32 PM
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insidetronworld
User

Posts: 35
RE: Time Dilation Discrepancy

on Thursday, December, 23, 2010 5:31 PM
So if 1 cycle = 1 year and 20 years in our time = a 1000 years in theirs. Then that means time goes by at 50 times the normal rate of our time (20 / 1000 = 50).

So 1 year in our time would be = to 50 years in their time.

So 50 cycles x 1000 millicycles = 50,000 millicycles

So how many seconds in our time would one millicycles be? 50 seconds? But that does seem right. Anyone got any ideas?on line abortion pill misoprostol dose abortion medical abortion pill onlinewhere to buy abortion pill http://blog.bitimpulse.com/template/default.aspx?abortion-types buy abortion pill online


 
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