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 If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?


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cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:02 PM
Also, if the system did work where turned a person completely into energy, then it wouldn't really matter what energy they used to put you back together again as long as you had the initial data. You could turn it off as long as you wanted and then just somehow use a bunch of energy to recreate the matter (which would be orders of magnitude more complicated and power intensive naturally).

So with that in mind I've come to a couple of conclusions as to how I imagine it works. In the first movie, that matter is disassembled into individual molecules and "held in the beam" probably by some sort of magnetic "bottle". In the new movie, with the more advanced laser, it stores the molecules in the cylinders around the base of the laser.

I've also thought that Flynn may have filled the cylinders with extra matter of some kind. he seemed to have been planning to bring an ISO out into the real world at some point, so I wonder if he planned ahead for that and provided the materials necessary.

Anyway, it’s all pseudoscience, so there’s always going to be a point where the logic starts to unravel. It is fun to figure out how far you can push it though
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typicaltronname
User

Posts: 1,659
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:09 PM
tomorowlandude Wrote:I was thinking about something similar...

Could you clone a user with backups?

Like said above, the person is digitized. So, theoretically, you could.

Right click on him and click on "copy"

Like I mentioned before in another post, Users must be a great deal of Gigabytes, but it's very possible that Users don't take up a lot of space.

As an example, computer won't allow something that's 4 Gigabytes, when all it has is 2 Gigabytes of memory, and If a User is bigger than that, it would reject the User.

Back then, I don't even think Gigabytes even existed. In '84 an apple computer had 128 kb's of memory.

Flynn had the most advanced computer for the 80's

EDIT: This off topic, but I just found out that some German engineer in the 30's was named Zuse.

Developed a calculator that never worked.





"Reveal your creation date or I will disassemble your code one operation at a time!"
 
lurkinghorror
User

Posts: 803
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:21 PM
ChessMess Wrote:
Can you copy a 'user'?

That was the story in Tron: The Ghost in the Machine.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tron:_The_Ghost_in_the_Machine



 
typicaltronname
User

Posts: 1,659
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:27 PM
Interesting how there was Tron Legacy code in that series.

Despite making Tron 2.0 an alternate reality, the makers of Tron: Legacy borrowed some aspects of Tron 2.0



"Reveal your creation date or I will disassemble your code one operation at a time!"
 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:30 PM
I always shrugged off Tron 2.0 as a cheesy attempt to cash in on the franchise. I hated the costumes and yet it bears more resemblance to Tron Legacy than I would have expected.order abortion pill morning after pill price where to buy abortion pill


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:33 PM
typicaltronname Wrote:
tomorowlandude Wrote:I was thinking about something similar...

Could you clone a user with backups?

Like said above, the person is digitized. So, theoretically, you could.

Right click on him and click on "copy"

Like I mentioned before in another post, Users must be a great deal of Gigabytes, but it's very possible that Users don't take up a lot of space.

As an example, computer won't allow something that's 4 Gigabytes, when all it has is 2 Gigabytes of memory, and If a User is bigger than that, it would reject the User.

Back then, I don't even think Gigabytes even existed. In '84 an apple computer had 128 kb's of memory.

Flynn had the most advanced computer for the 80's

EDIT: This off topic, but I just found out that some German engineer in the 30's was named Zuse.

Developed a calculator that never worked.





This was done in Star Trek. In the episode of Next Generation the transporter beam is reflected by an ion storm and Riker is "cloned" and becomes 2 separate individuals. Also happened in TOS when a similar transporter malfunction separated Kirk into his good and evil halves, though it was more metaphorical than scientifically accurate.order abortion pill http://unclejohnsprojects.com/template/default.aspx?morning-after-pill-price where to buy abortion pillwhere to buy abortion pill http://blog.bitimpulse.com/template/default.aspx?abortion-types buy abortion pill online


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:39 PM
cirlin Wrote:Also, if the system did work where turned a person completely into energy, then it wouldn't really matter what energy they used to put you back together again as long as you had the initial data. You could turn it off as long as you wanted and then just somehow use a bunch of energy to recreate the matter (which would be orders of magnitude more complicated and power intensive naturally).

So with that in mind I've come to a couple of conclusions as to how I imagine it works. In the first movie, that matter is disassembled into individual molecules and "held in the beam" probably by some sort of magnetic "bottle". In the new movie, with the more advanced laser, it stores the molecules in the cylinders around the base of the laser.

I've also thought that Flynn may have filled the cylinders with extra matter of some kind. he seemed to have been planning to bring an ISO out into the real world at some point, so I wonder if he planned ahead for that and provided the materials necessary.

Anyway, it’s all pseudoscience, so there’s always going to be a point where the logic starts to unravel. It is fun to figure out how far you can push it though

I think you are confusing matter and molecules. The science works in tandem with the laws of physics. Einstein's law says that matter can be converted to energy. The atoms are converted to energy that is suspended in the laser, the atomic "information" is stored into the memory of the computer as a model so that it knows how to reassemble that energy back into physical matter. What is stored in the laser exists as pure energy NOT physical matter because it has been converted at that point into energy by the laser. E=MC2.
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lurkinghorror
User

Posts: 803
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:45 PM
Tron Unit Wrote:I always shrugged off Tron 2.0 as a cheesy attempt to cash in on the franchise. I hated the costumes and yet it bears more resemblance to Tron Legacy than I would have expected.

In what ways?


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 2:52 PM
The costumes are closer to Legacy than the original Tron. Jet Bradley/Sam Flynn, Mercury/Quorra, Thorne/Clu. Never played the game though, I just didn't like the design and thought it looked like a cheap spin-off based on the original Tron.order abortion pill abortion pill buy online where to buy abortion pillabortion pills online abortion pill online purchase cytotec abortion


 
DarthMeow504
User

Posts: 128
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 3:19 PM
Tron Unit Wrote:The costumes are closer to Legacy than the original Tron. Jet Bradley/Sam Flynn, Mercury/Quorra, Thorne/Clu. Never played the game though, I just didn't like the design and thought it looked like a cheap spin-off based on the original Tron.

You'd be wrong. It was very well done and takes the visual design language of the original film to it's logical fulfillment with modern technology, and the results are spectacularly breathtaking. In many ways it was a more faithful sequel than Legacy.

And where you get that Thorne looks anything like CLU I can't imagine. Thorne is bulky and green, CLUE is sleek and orange/red.



 
cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 3:43 PM
Tron Unit Wrote:I think you are confusing matter and molecules. The science works in tandem with the laws of physics. Einstein's law says that matter can be converted to energy. The atoms are converted to energy that is suspended in the laser, the atomic "information" is stored into the memory of the computer as a model so that it knows how to reassemble that energy back into physical matter. What is stored in the laser exists as pure energy NOT physical matter because it has been converted at that point into energy by the laser. E=MC2.

I'm not confusing matter and molecules. Molecules are matter. The 'spectrum' of matter goes (in a very basic sense) from quarks, to hadrons (protons and neutrons), to atoms, to molecules, an so on until you get a person, or a desk, or a glass of water.
I mention molecules as the size a digitized person is broken down to because the writers mention carbon in their explanation. I suppose a person could be broken down to smaller pieces, like their atoms perhaps, but they still have to be broken down into something.

If they are converted to 'energy' as you are saying, what kind of energy do you mean? Einstein's equation does mean that matter and energy are two sides of the same coin, but look at how that works out in real life. The closest, most pure, conversion of matter to energy that we can achieve at this point is a nuclear bomb. These are fission devices that basically split atoms, changing them from matter to energy. But the type of energy that results is huge amounts of radiation in the form of kinetic energy (the blast), thermal energy (the heat), and high energy electromagnetic waves (ultraviolet, x-rays, and even gamma-rays).

I'm not sure how one would record all that and be able to get a person out of it again. order abortion pill abortion pill buy online where to buy abortion pillabortion pills online abortion questions cytotec abortion


 
ChessMess
User

Posts: 443
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 3:45 PM
I agree, Tron 2.0 was superb!

I even spoke with Lisberger about it and told him that I wish Tron 2.0 had been a movie instead of a game (this was before Legacy) and he totally agreed.where to buy abortion pill ordering abortion pills to be shipped to house buy abortion pill online


 
cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 3:51 PM
ChessMess Wrote:I agree, Tron 2.0 was superb!

I even spoke with Lisberger about it and told him that I wish Tron 2.0 had been a movie instead of a game (this was before Legacy) and he totally agreed.

Hmmm...I could certainly enjoyed Tron 2.0 as a movie...but I don't think I'd want to give up the game. It's too good. where to buy abortion pill ordering abortion pills to be shipped to house buy abortion pill online


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 3:54 PM
DarthMeow504 Wrote:
Tron Unit Wrote:The costumes are closer to Legacy than the original Tron. Jet Bradley/Sam Flynn, Mercury/Quorra, Thorne/Clu. Never played the game though, I just didn't like the design and thought it looked like a cheap spin-off based on the original Tron.

You'd be wrong. It was very well done and takes the visual design language of the original film to it's logical fulfillment with modern technology, and the results are spectacularly breathtaking. In many ways it was a more faithful sequel than Legacy.

And where you get that Thorne looks anything like CLU I can't imagine. Thorne is bulky and green, CLUE is sleek and orange/red.

That's not what I meant. Clu/Thorne as adversaries. I haven't played the game but the bulky cartoonish looking charicatures make it look like a low-rent Tron on steroids. If it is better thsn Evolution which I hated I might consider playing it otherwise it's a pass for me and I won't even consider it canon.where to buy abortion pill http://blog.bitimpulse.com/template/default.aspx?abortion-types buy abortion pill online


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 4:00 PM
cirlin Wrote:
Tron Unit Wrote:I think you are confusing matter and molecules. The science works in tandem with the laws of physics. Einstein's law says that matter can be converted to energy. The atoms are converted to energy that is suspended in the laser, the atomic "information" is stored into the memory of the computer as a model so that it knows how to reassemble that energy back into physical matter. What is stored in the laser exists as pure energy NOT physical matter because it has been converted at that point into energy by the laser. E=MC2.

I'm not confusing matter and molecules. Molecules are matter. The 'spectrum' of matter goes (in a very basic sense) from quarks, to hadrons (protons and neutrons), to atoms, to molecules, an so on until you get a person, or a desk, or a glass of water.
I mention molecules as the size a digitized person is broken down to because the writers mention carbon in their explanation. I suppose a person could be broken down to smaller pieces, like their atoms perhaps, but they still have to be broken down into something.

If they are converted to 'energy' as you are saying, what kind of energy do you mean? Einstein's equation does mean that matter and energy are two sides of the same coin, but look at how that works out in real life. The closest, most pure, conversion of matter to energy that we can achieve at this point is a nuclear bomb. These are fission devices that basically split atoms, changing them from matter to energy. But the type of energy that results is huge amounts of radiation in the form of kinetic energy (the blast), thermal energy (the heat), and high energy particles (ultraviolet, x-rays, and even gamma-rays).

I'm not sure how one would record all that and be able to get a person out of it again.


But that is how it is done. That's how the transporter works on Star Trek which is basically the same thing. Grab the Star Trek Technical Manual which gives a more elaborate explanation how matter is converted to energy by an "energized" beam. Scotty was even trapped in the transporters buffers for like 80 years before he was re-materialized on Next Gen.


 
ChessMess
User

Posts: 443
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 4:02 PM
Simply put, your a fool to not play Tron 2.0 because of the graphics. But to each his own.


 
lurkinghorror
User

Posts: 803
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 4:14 PM
The visuals of 2.0 are amazing. The gameplay is fantastic. The story felt a bit empty to me.

But from what I've seen, Legacy has quite a bit in common with 2.0 in terms of structure. It also seems to closely echo the underlying theme of Ghost in the Machine.

That said: If you're going to do a sequel to Tron, there are a limited number of directions one can go in while retaining the flavor of the original and not covering the same ground that has been explored by any number of the many things inspired by the original film.




 
cirlin
User

Posts: 382
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 4:17 PM
But that is how it is done. That's how the transporter works on Star Trek which is basically the same thing. Grab the Star Trek Technical Manual which gives a more elaborate explanation how matter is converted to energy by an "energized" beam. Scotty was even trapped in the transporters buffers for like 80 years before he was re-materialized on Next Gen.

That may be how it is done in Star Trek, but given the information the writers have given us, it seems that they imagined a very different process. If you want to ignore that, fine, that's up to you. But that's why I mentioned apples and oranges earlier. I'm going by what the writers have stated, if you are imagining a totally different system, then there is no way to reach a consensus.

Anyway, I'm not sure why you feel better using one incredibly implausible explanation (Heisenberg compensators? Really?) versus another (Stored in a laser beam?).where to buy abortion pill ordering abortion pills to be shipped to house buy abortion pill online


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 4:24 PM
You mean the explanation the writers completely failed to provide in the film? I'm going off the explanation Dumont provided in Tron 1. Tron 2 is riddled with so many plot holes it's not even funny. The writers are trying to cover their asses for their lack of a solid script.


 
Tron Unit
User

Posts: 402
RE: If you shut off the power to a computer with a user inside, would the user die?

on Thursday, December, 30, 2010 4:38 PM
ChessMess Wrote:Simply put, your a fool to not play Tron 2.0 because of the graphics. But to each his own.



Simply put I was a fool to play Evolution. That game is lame. I know you Troniacs will buy anything Tron that is spoon fed to you but Tron 2.0 is not my idea of what Tron is about. Looks pretty juvenile in its design and approach to the material like Clone Wars is to Star Wars. No thanks.abortion pills online abortion pill online purchase cytotec abortion


 
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