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ChessMess
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Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Tuesday, November, 02, 2010 7:48 AM
With the latest Quorra/Sam reveal (and I also worry that to much is being spoiled), when they go 'Off Grid' its basically saying "Off Road" and the car kicks up dirt and dust as it moves and it looks like clods of dirt in the 'off grid' section.

I'm a bit mixed on this, I understand they need to differentiate these environments, but I wonder if going for the more 'real world' feel was the best approach. Easiest, sure, but couldn't not necessarily the most true to the whole 'digital world'.

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cirlin
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Posts: 382
RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Tuesday, November, 02, 2010 10:54 AM
To my eyes the debris that they drive across and kick up is like a lot of the things in the digital realm in that they are analogs to real world things, but have their own digital character. The rock walls and mesas that they are driving through look similar to normal ones, but they have a flat, grey less defined look to them. At the same time they look more defined than in the original movie, and so for me these sort of characteristics are a great balance between the otherworldly low-rez environments of the original, and the real world.
I especially like the contrast between the digital "stone" and the white glowing walls, floors, etc, in Flynn's hideout.
Also, have you seen this scene in the theater, or just the youtube video that got released? If you've only seen the youtube video it likely that those "digital" qualities are not very apparent due to the relatively low quality and low lighting.


 
Tron Fanatic
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Tuesday, November, 02, 2010 3:11 PM
I too have been bugged by this to a degree, but as far as I could tell, I was the only one. Even before I noticed dirt, the lighting in the first teaser felt off. Not the glows, but I mean, that lights were actually needed for the purpose of illuminating objects (ie: headlights). This is something I never thought would have any need to exist in Tron, because absolutely everything emits its own light. I never thought there would be any kind of dynamic lighting (or shadows). When I started planning out a Doom 3 mod for TRON, even though Doom 3 sports very advanced (for the time) lighting effects, I left most of those features out because it just didn't feel right to me.

Oh yeah, has anyone noticed this besides me? On TRON night after the screening, we went into the mall, walked past an Apple store, and my first thought was, "Oh, Flynn's place." I had an urge to go there on Halloween dressed in his druidish garb, kneel down in the middle of the store and start meditating. Would've been interesting to see if anyone got the joke before kicking me out.

'>
 
cirlin
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Posts: 382
RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Tuesday, November, 02, 2010 4:58 PM
Regarding lights not being needed in the Tron world, in the original we see the Recognizer that finds Tron and Yori using one to search the area.
Also I don't think everything glows, but I did have the impression that there is some sort of general source-less illumination throughout the world; the brightness of which was possibly effected by the amount of energy in the general area.


 
c1
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Posts: 324
RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Tuesday, November, 02, 2010 5:37 PM
My theory is the new 'server' in this computer realm is older, hence the dust. We all need to grab the can of Dust Off once in a while on our computers. Just like at the end of Tron, all the IO Towers light up, it has been cleansed of evil.


 
FusionAddict
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Posts: 450
RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Wednesday, November, 03, 2010 3:13 PM
One of the classic themes of the Tron series is evolution and its relation to sentience. Flynn's server was built using the Encom system as its base. Because of time dilation the 20 years it ran evolution took place in the system. The programs became more sentient, their clothing and vehicles evolved into new, sleeker forms, the server itself created life in the form of the Isos, who crawled from the digital "primordial ooze" of the energy pools. The world itself has evolved as a reflection of this...the neon and glass of the original server has tesselated and fractalized itself into rock and stone. And as such, it has gained matter-like qualities, such as dust & erosion.

The Clu abides, man...

 
ShadowDragon1
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Wednesday, November, 03, 2010 4:02 PM
Beautifully put FusionAddict, and makes logical sense to me. Sounds like your pretty much on the mark. Well said, very well said.

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
Traahn
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Wednesday, November, 03, 2010 5:31 PM
The Tron:Betrayal comic teaches us this evolution in scenery and atmosphere takes place within a year, not 20+ years. Tron:Evolution appears like it will do the same.where to buy abortion pill abortion types buy abortion pill online


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. -----^
 
ShadowDragon1
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Wednesday, November, 03, 2010 6:23 PM
this isn't so much about the visaul style in T:B, T:E, or Tron Legacy, but the underlying "realness" of The Grid.

Flynn introduced genetic algorythms ( Alan Bradley mentioned "genetic algorythms" to Sam in one of the clips shown on Tron Night) into The Grid, along with A.I., so things were allowed to "evolve" *intrinsically*.
The visual look of things is The Grid (or in terms of the design artists Daniel Simon and Neville Page) is an extrapolation from the visual design elements from alot of Syd Mead's early concept design from the original TRON. That's an *aesthetic* "evolution" in a visual sense. Within The Grid the "evolution" is in a more internalized and intrinsic form, and in terms of the society of Programs itself.

Plus, I didn't see any particular portrayal dust, dirt or a large expanse of cube-ish fractal or tessalated type "outlands" in Tron: Betrayal... which I think "grew" along with the continued materialization of Isos over the course of 20,000 cyberspace years (20 yrs real world time)....order abortion pill http://unclejohnsprojects.com/template/default.aspx?morning-after-pill-price where to buy abortion pill

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
FusionAddict
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Posts: 450
RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Wednesday, November, 03, 2010 7:10 PM
Plus, I didn't see any particular portrayal dust, dirt or a large expanse of cube-ish fractal or tessalated type "outlands" in Tron: Betrayal... which I think "grew" along with the continued materialization of Isos over the course of 20,000 cyberspace years (20 yrs real world time)....

That's not what I mean.

Fractalization doesn't necessarily LOOK like a fractal you're thinking of. A salt block, for example, can be any sort of shape. However, if one reduces it down to its crystalline pattern, you see a basic cube, a shape that can be seen even at the molecular level.

The same thing applies to computer technology, especially graphics. The vector becomes the segment becomes the spline becomes the polygon becomes the prism becomes the mesh becomes the model. The objects of the evolved Tron world are the geometricaly extrapolated iterations based on the original objects in that universe.

The Clu abides, man...

 
ShadowDragon1
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Wednesday, November, 03, 2010 7:21 PM
I understand that. Hence why i said the "evolution" is intrinsic and internal. I was agreeing with your original post. My post was in reply to Traahn....

Your "preaching to the choir" man. lol

"The film is about finding human connection in an increasingly digital world." - Joseph Kosinski

 
Traahn
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 1:08 AM
So did the Tron world go from 1982 Tron universe to 2010 Tron universe mainly in 1 year, or gradually over 28 years. Based on Kosinski interviews, I would've thought the latter. The comic teaches me otherwise, but I think that is just to try and sell more comics and cut straight to the new-design chase.order abortion pill http://unclejohnsprojects.com/template/default.aspx?morning-after-pill-price where to buy abortion pill


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. -----^
 
CaptainCR
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 3:17 AM
Traahn Wrote:So did the Tron world go from 1982 Tron universe to 2010 Tron universe mainly in 1 year, or gradually over 28 years. Based on Kosinski interviews, I would've thought the latter. The comic teaches me otherwise, but I think that is just to try and sell more comics and cut straight to the new-design chase.

they comic actually is more than just a way to get money, it provides back story as to what happened leading up to kevin's disappearance. and ppl seem to forget this tron world is not only visually slightly different than the original, but it;s also not the original server..kevin essentially created a new server/"Tron world" and transfered tron himself over from the old one to the new one. but the world in the comic and the first half of the game is slightly different than what will be in tron legacy in terms of being a utopia and turning into a dystopia.

"You know you don't look a thing like your pictures?"
 
Traahn
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 10:45 AM
I dont forget that. I just don't agree that a year later, even on a different server, it would look so different than the original world. In the end, I just chalk it up to the comic makers not thinking anyone would notice or care that the comic would show off the sleeker look so soon in the 'evolution'. We can create explanations for any changes we see. I'll wait to see if the book supports a more gradual shift in appearance. If not, it's a bit of a disservice to the original film to toss various things aside so quickly in the supposed evolution. If all that slowly evolved from oiginsl state in the galapagos world are lightcycles and a couple other minor things, that's not what I was thinking when we were told things evolved. Explaining the new looks as simply being on a different server isn't an evolution; it's 'being on a different server'. The old system was connected to the Internet, with access to the latest/greatest knowledge, research and info available at the time. The MCP grew about 2,415 times smarter since being created. 900-1200 times smarter than any human. You'd think the costumes, physics and world wouldnt look and act too differently in the connected 1982 system versus the isolated server in 1983. order abortion pill abortion pill buy online where to buy abortion pill


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. -----^
 
Tron Fanatic
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 10:58 AM
Just how much have we 'evolved' as a society in the past 100 years? NYC looks pretty much the same now as it did when it became a city. The buildings are still square, gray, and have windows... there's just a lot more of them.

And another thing to consider, is that the way computers work, really hasn't changed. I expect things to look a lot more different on OUR side than on theirs. We see fancier graphics, faster operating systems, and fancy new peripherals with 3D glasses, but to a computer, that's still all 1's and 0's. The raw code hasn't changed. So why would anything look so vastly different to the programs? All a faster CPU would do is adjust the time differential between their world and ours. Bigger hard drives and RAM would give them more space to run around in.

'>
 
Pilgrim1099
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Posts: 606
RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 11:59 AM
Traahn Wrote:I dont forget that. I just don't agree that a year later, even on a different server, it would look so different than the original world. In the end, I just chalk it up to the comic makers not thinking anyone would notice or care that the comic would show off the sleeker look so soon in the 'evolution'. We can create explanations for any changes we see. I'll wait to see if the book supports a more gradual shift in appearance.

Traahn, great points. I've thought about this too. The comic version screwed the pooch because it was shown that Clu 2.0 was created in 1984. You can see this as evidence from the hospital scene with the April calendar next to the nurse. While, in the Wiki sources, it was in 1988.

Secondly, if Flynn copied Tron over, how did he do it? Via the Internet or a disk? Wouldn't Alan Bradley have noticed this copy activity? Wouldn't the original Tron, out of loyalty, report this to Alan-One?

Third, it was said that Tron : Evolution game is canon. If so, then where did the Abraxas virus come from? I recall in one interview, it was said that they're on a new server independent from ENCOM, however, one source online mentions that Abraxas attacks the ENCOM system. So, clearly, which one is it? Did someone send the virus to infect and screw with Flynn?

Are the screenwriters overlooking this mistake, I wonder? If the viral threat from Evolution attacks ENCOM, it would've made more sense for Flynn to cut his server off to contain Abraxas after creating Clu to deal with him. Not that ISO nonsense from Marvel. I suspect the ISOs have a different background and history in the game and film compared to the comic.





 
Tron Fanatic
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 1:48 PM
Sheesh. Not even in theaters yet and the re-imagined Tron franchise is already getting as many plot holes as... *gasp* Star Wars?

'>
 
CaptainCR
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 3:05 PM
i think people are over analyzing things a bit....sure there maybe some questionable things right now but whose to say all of it won't make sense by the time the film comes out? after all they said all the different mediums in which the story is cannon were all worked on closely together, the comic, the game, and the movie. I'm sure there aren't going t be any MAJOR plot holes if any.

and as much fait as Disney is putting into this film, as much money and marketing they are putting into it it, you really think it's gonna be bad?

and no offense but i feel like ppl are just but hurt things don't look 100% exactly like the original.
now i'm a big of fan of the original as much as anybody else but i don't see the point in getting so upset. honestly i would have less interest and the newer stuff if it looked exactly like the original. have things look a little different and sleeker is more interesting IMO. and at least things aren't overly different. you can look at the newer world of tron and still go "oh yea, that's tron" ya know? it's not like they totally butchered what we all know and love...and if Steven Lisberger is on board and attached to this film as well as being excited about it, well then dammit that's good enough for me.

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"You know you don't look a thing like your pictures?"
 
xalener
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 4:00 PM
The dust itself is pretty digital looking. I mean it looks like the smoke from little big planet. That fits in with the theme of the film pretty well.

The particle effect itself isn't really that complex. Probably on purpose.

Alan: I was paged last night. Came from your dad's arcade
sam: So?
Alan: the number's been disconnected for 20 years!
Sam: THEN WHO WAS PAGER
 
Traahn
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RE: Dirt and Dust in the Digital Domain

on Thursday, November, 04, 2010 5:47 PM
No, CaptainCR, I'm analyzing not over-analyzing. And I'm not hurt by the new look. You may be over-analyzing the analyzers


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. -----^
 
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