I think Crom grasped it, he was just confident that he was going to win, and Flynn would lose. He was wrong, unfortunately. I think Flynn must have thought that there was some sort of safety net or something down there, to keep the players safe, and was being chivalrous to Crom, not kicking his butt when he was defenseless. When Sark told him to "finish the game", he realized it was a deathmatch in the most literal way, and refused to play anymore.

The way I thought of it was that we don't know how long Crom had been there playing games. We see him lose to Sark and somehow survive. He may have been one of the best of the ring game. Flynn was a newbie who had no experience as far as Crom knew. Crom thought he had an advantage.

Oh, interesting topic!

I know there’s been a some people on here (and elsewhere I would imagine) that were a bit disappointed with Legacy having so many problems with plot holes, continuity, etc, so it will interesting to see what comes up on here.

One thing I do like about Legacy was that the writers have managed to get rid of some of the more, to put it mildly, ‘Stranger Aspects’ of the first film-the visual/conceptual elements of the film that I, personally thought were slightly odd looking.

For example, when Tron & Yori were making their way to the I/O Tower and they see the obsolete Data Pushers (or “Weirdo’s” ), and they’re all look like light bulbs, computer chips, faceless monks or big hairy things that look something from Sesame Street.

Also, Sark being given the MCP’s power and then turning into a giant with black eyes.
Even the MCP looks fantastical-a huge, shimmering rotating pillar of light with a face on it (which turned out in fact to be an old ‘man’ typing away on some kind of typewriter thing-if Dillinger created the MCP, why doesn’t it look like him?).

Elements like this were done mostly for just visual effect rather a sense of logic-Sark has grown more powerful because of the MCP, so he then grows to a huge size to represent this this, whilst the Data Pushers are just the writers/producers showing the audience what a strange, wonderful fantasy world this is (again, it’s mostly the VISUAL aspect that’s emphasised here rather then the NARRATIVE).

Legacy, (and Evolution/Betrayal has well to a certain extent), have managed to ‘cut back’ a lot on the more fantasy-looking elements to make The Grid look more sleeker & stylish then the first film-no black eyed giants, ’weirdo’ looking Data Pushers, insect like Gridbugs, etc.
The way they’ve created The Grid is to make it look more ‘streamlined’ and elegant then the old Encom system of the first film-even the ISOs look like they ’related’ (cousins, has it were) to the mostly black-suited Basic programs then some guy dressed like a light bulb or a hairy Muppet.
This is understandable really-after all, this is the 21st century, and we’ve come a long way from the brightly coloured Pac-Man style arcade games of the early 80s….

emdeesee Wrote: Kat wrote: Am I missing something essential in this scene that would explain why neither one of them grasps the gravity of the situation??? Har! I think you're right about Flynn, that he's clueless and (one imagines) experiencing a fair amount of shock at his situation. Any weirdness in his reactions can be chalked up to that. There's a lot going on with Crom, though. At first, I think he's trying to project a bravado he doesn't feel, covering desperation. It's one of his first games, if not his first, and they've matched him up with a fellow conscript. To Crom, who doesn't know Flynn from any other program, Flynn is a traitor, probably being tested before joining the warrior elite of the MCP. Why else would Crom's opponent be blue instead of red? He must imagine he's matched against someone Sark has assessed as having some talent, too. The giveaway is Crom's line, "You think you're going to wipe me right out, don't you?" This is something someone who sees himself as the underdog would say. A truly confident combatant would probably just keep his mouth shut, or maybe say, "I'm going to wipe you right out!" While Flynn is still processing the accusation, Crom attacks pretty aggressively. This, too, strikes me as somewhat desperate. For most of the rest of the game, Crom is actually winning, and he projects sense of his impending victory, some hope, and relief that he might make it out of this round alive. But then...

YES, this exactly is what I was trying to say. Though I thought Crom was losing. He seems to have fewer rings on his side at the end. I'd have to go back and watch it again and really follow the ball though, I suppose.

I've wondered, too, exactly how much Crom truly did understand. He does ask Ram what he's doing there... which makes sense. If he'd come from the Encom system, he'd know immediately what goes on in the Games, but Ram has to tell him he's going to get sent down "to have the bits blasted out of you." Still, after that he must have some idea. Though maybe he doesn't realize that fighting one of your own is not usual. Flynn certainly hasn't a clue. (I actually recently wrote a piece in which Tron's reflecting on Crom briefly for just this reason-- Tron's thinking that there are some like himself who are openly defiant and know what they're dying for, but others like Crom don't really have a clue, and they're just thrown into it by an innocent remark about the users but no desire to actually be dissident.)

EXODUS Wrote:Oh, interesting topic! I know there’s been a some people on here (and elsewhere I would imagine) that were a bit disappointed with Legacy having so many problems with plot holes, continuity, etc, so it will interesting to see what comes up on here.

That is one of my beefs with the original, yes. I can't knock it too much since I think much of the focus was on the effects and just on introducing a new concept, but when you really think about it, there IS a lot that they seem to have thrown in just because "hey, this seems cool!" Even though it makes little sense. And yes, I do think it about the inoperative data pushers and the gridbugs that you mentioned, though those aren't the only things. T82 has at least as many plot holes as T:L, but we never talk about it. (I do still long for a dedicated board like T:L and T:U have, I'm just saying...) And I'm perfectly willing to discuss it, esp. since most of the stuff about T:L has already been done to death... multiple times.

Please tell me that's sarcasm.

KingJ.exe Wrote:The way I thought of it was that we don't know how long Crom had been there playing games. We see him lose to Sark and somehow survive. He may have been one of the best of the ring game. Flynn was a newbie who had no experience as far as Crom knew. Crom thought he had an advantage.

^
This guy.

That is the same way I have always read it ever since I first saw it in 82.

Ram does tell Crom that "They'll train you for the games, but ...."

So that means that he was trained in how to play the games and most likely got good at them. I mean, he nearly took Flynn out on the first shot. (a bit due to Flynn's inexperience with "other side of the screen" gaming.)
So really we don't know how many cycles Crom has been playing since Flynn has gotten to The Grid but he definitely knows what he is doing now and was sure of himself against this noob.
That's my take.


The Sark thing where he grew big. On my recent viewing during the 30th celebration I kinda had a thought. Sark wasn't derezzed when his head was damaged so he was near derezzing. Then the MCP gave Sark's body all his power. Kinda giving the MCP a "body" to use since it wasn't really Sark anymore. (hence the darkened) eyes. And thus he became the Grid's first ZOMBIE! (Thanks to The Walking Dead for inpiring that line of thought)

Now...one thing that confused me and still to this day does is the "old guy on the typewriter" as the MCP. What and who was that? Why was it this old guy and not Dillinger, as stated in one of the above posts, as the MCP?

BanditTron Wrote: Now...one thing that confused me and still to this day does is the "old guy on the typewriter" as the MCP. What and who was that? Why was it this old guy and not Dillinger, as stated in one of the above posts, as the MCP?

The MCP was not Dillinger's program. The MCP said, "No one user wrote me, I'm worth millions of their man years." The program in the with the keyboard at the bitter end was probably the chess program that was apparently the basic framework for what eventually became the MCP.

emdeesee Wrote: BanditTron Wrote: Now...one thing that confused me and still to this day does is the "old guy on the typewriter" as the MCP. What and who was that? Why was it this old guy and not Dillinger, as stated in one of the above posts, as the MCP? The MCP was not Dillinger's program. The MCP said, "No one user wrote me, I'm worth millions of their man years." The program in the with the keyboard at the bitter end was probably the chess program that was apparently the basic framework for what eventually became the MCP.

With regards to the whole ‘typewriter and aged face’ thing I can think of two things:

The typewriter represents the endless stream of calculations that such a large, highly complex program like that does constantly.
And the aged face thing represents just how different it has become since it was first created. Like Clu, the MCP is UNIQUE, and stands quite apart from the more normal programs. It is quite old, lets not forget (to quote Dumont “…old enough to remember when the MCP was just a chess program”), so it’s been running for quite a few years by then.
And it has evolved to-”I have gotten 1257 times smarter since then” and “no one User created me, I’m worth millions of their man years”.
Maybe all this increasing power, sophistication & influence has had some adverse effect on it, which results in some kind of ‘ageing process’ (although they still should have David Warner to have done, wearing a lot of make-up of course).

In an older version (http://www.imsdb.com/scripts/TRON.html):


620 SHOT OF THE MCP 620


We see something materializing in the apex of the energy cones. It
is dressed like Dumont was at the I/0 Tower, an old man in the
padded altar costume, spinning, slowly, finally stopping. We see the
wizened, wrinkled face of the true MCP for just a few seconds, and
see that he is furiosly TYPING on an old Remington portable. Then he
too dissolves into liquid energy, and disappears. The cylinder of
the MCP glows brighter and brighter.

621 YORI AND THE BIT 621

on the bridge of the carrier looking down at this.

622 HER POV 622

A fountain of energy explodes upwards like a Supernova, right at the
camera.

623 YORI 623

shielding her face from the power of the blast.

624 LONG SHOT 624


The nova of energy bursting upwards. We start to see the glow
returning to the surrounding domains, as the nova dissipates,
leaving the sky full of sparkling stars.

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